There isn't one for second either, JLAS. But then we've gone many years in the past without getting a trophy. Far be it from me to tell people what they may wish to consider if all they are concerned about is winning. There will always be some 19 other teams (and three that will be bitterly disappointed) who will not be happy 'winning' campers at the end of the season.

Of course we shouldn't care about third or fourth place -- it only means the difference between Champions League football and UEFA.

You're right though, of course, we have nothing to be proud of, nothing to look forward to and may as well just following the complaining lemmings over the cliff.

[/quote]oh yeah, I always forget about the 3rd place trophy[/quote]

Ouch!

Whats a lemming?

A BLING LEMON.

[quote]Posted 19 March 2007 12:04 PM Hide Post
A BLING LEMON.[/quote]


I dont beleev you though

either that or something i cought up in the morning.

[quote]Whats a lemming?[/quote]

They are small rodents that breed rapidly and because of that when food becomes sparse, they often migrate in large groups. Because of the large groups, some can often be pushed off cliffs or drowned in bodies of water by the press of other lemmings. While the myth of 'self-death' is erroneous, lemmings are often used as a metaphor for people who go along unquestioningly with popular opinion -- which in this case is that we are worthless, the majority of our players aren't fit for red and white, our manager needs to be concerned about his job, and that we aren't good enough to win.

And, then there are those of us, who are berated because we won't get into the berating of the players and vaidate our frustrations through belittling the players, manager and club -- all in the interest of enlightened criticism, you know! Seems a bit ironic -- the non-beraters are themselves then berated!

[quote]No, BSC, don't you know that to be a 'real' fan, one must pule and whinge and pulverize our own team.[/quote]

You don't have to do that either. But to be told that your not allowed to have an opinion if it goes against the general concensus (or the concensus of the 'in' crowd at least) is getting rather tedious.

I love my Arsenal, I always will. But that doesn't mean I have to be happy with everything that happens. I wasn't in the early 80's or when we signed that chimp Rioch either.

any 1 thats thinks aw should be worried about there job must be crazy.

[quote]when you become a winning team, the bar is raised, the level of expectations is massive, demand for results etc

Ain't "dont settle for second best" a winning mentality? many fans don't want to settle for third

to say "oh its ok, there are 17 teams worse of than us, lets be happy" is neither here nor there

Like I've said numerous times on this forum, yes the futures good etc, but that doesn't mean we don't have problems now, we can't all hide behind one-liners like "oh but we have the best stadium in the world" etc

I won't criticise the team, but I'm not surprised there are lots of people moaning, why wouldn't they? they are dissapointed with a trophyless season[/quote]

Frankly, JLAS, *I* am not happy not winning anything. I don't lose well and have never settled for second-best. What I'm not going to buy into is all the venting of frustration by solving the inconsistencies or lackings through absolutely ripping apart players and the manager.

Some think that being highly critical, trashing the team, trashing players, tossing out the manager, is all the way they 'enjoy' football. Others take a more positive approach and try to see what is good and what there is to look forward to instead of what to moan about.

No one is saying don't moan. But don't expect those of us who are positive to not speak our mind too.

And do NOT ever assume that just because I don't find pleasure in ripping apart players or the club, that I don't care or am happy about not winning. That would be the really symbolic 'assume'.

I really wish some of you had been around when we really were rubbish. Back in the days when we had no chance of Europe, a mid table finish and possibly a half decent run in the Cup to look forward to. Some of you lot who have only been around since Wenger have been spoilt and I won't cry to much if we lose a few of you to other things should we have a difficult season or 2 ( finishing 4th and being in the European Cup doesn't count as difficult).

only 12 years ago we were just above villa. wonder what people would say if that happened now

[quote]Frankly, JLAS, *I* am not happy not winning anything. I don't lose well and have never settled for second-best.[/quote]

well you ain't happy just like the moaners ain't happy, but they just happen to speak out about it rather than using all those one-liners that you listed

[quote]chimp Rioch either.[/quote]

First, let me say that I have never told you or anyone else that you are 'not allowed to have an opinion'. The general consensus on this board seems to be that it's a rip and tear mentality so actually I and some others are in the minority. It's those of us who prefer a more positive approach to criticism and analysis that are told we are lesser fans and don't care about winning.

Now the 'chimp Rioch' comment is baffling. Are you comparing him to Arsene? Are you simply saying that signing Rioch didn't make you happy? I can understand that in part, even though he was only here one season and DID manage to sign Bergkamp for us (and manage to ostracize Wright who then asked for a transfer), take us to a UEFA spot by finishing fifth, and get us to the League Cup semi-finals and to the third round FA cup.

But comparing him to Wenger? Now that's baffling.